Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

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Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Rusakov » Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:43 pm

The calendar thread inspired this post, but I've had some of this in mind for a while.

What if the SWAT Kats universe is post-apocalyptic. Not for the kats... but for humanity!

There's a lot of overlap between kat culture and human culture, too much to be coincidental. Maybe humanity existed at one point with the kats sapient a little while before humanity died out. Perhaps the kats were created as servants or intelligent pets for humans.

Which brings an interesting -and disturbing- possibility: perhaps the kats were responsible for human extinction somehow.

Looping back to the calendar thread: perhaps Christmas is when the kats took control. After which they created a new calendar starting at year 0, but kept calculations and names the same. I'm suggesting a year 0 "reset" as too much time seems to have passed for humans to be mentioned casually (but might still be mentioned in folklore or religious myth).
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by marklungo » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:12 pm

If Lance Falk's original idea for "When Strikes Mutilor" had been made, we would have learned that kats and humans exist in the same unvierse. Hmmm...

Anyway, this theory gives me a story idea. Thanks to the Pastmaster, the SWAT Kats go back in time to just before the kats replace the humans. Can the SWAT Kats stop the slaughter of humanity without endangering their own timeline?
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by EditorElohim » Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:38 pm

Unfortunately, the creators of the series did not focus too much on the background of their world beyond: a large megalopolis with criminals and inhabited by anthropomorphic cats. The issue of the true location of the Swat Kats' world seems more relevant to me than the era itself.

Although interesting, the theory of humans as a precursor species I see as implausible, there being other explanations for the similarities to our world. Plus little or no evidence.

I have a few theories:

1) It's Earth, identical to ours - countries, governments, culture, geography, etc- ; only inhabited by kats instead of humans and.... I don't know, raccoons and otters instead of dogs and cats.

- It's the one I see to my mind as the most likely, but since there's no mention in the series of a government above the city as a state or nation, it's hard to guess. I only know of three possible circumstantial evidences to support this theory: a) The mention of Christmas trees, b) The mention of Kathmandu in chapter 5, c) A map that appears fleetingly in the Museum during the first chapter in which South America and Africa are seen.

2) It's Earth, but a la Strangereal; that is, with the same cultures, customs and so on, but with different geography, nations and names we wouldn't recognize.


3) It is another planet, possibly influenced directly or indirectly by human civilization, as both species had the same species or civilization precursor, for example.
marklungo wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:12 pm
If Lance Falk's original idea for "When Strikes Mutilor" had been made, we would have learned that kats and humans exist in the same unvierse. Hmmm...

Anyway, this theory gives me a story idea. Thanks to the Pastmaster, the SWAT Kats go back in time to just before the kats replace the humans. Can the SWAT Kats stop the slaughter of humanity without endangering their own timeline?

This is also possible. In my SG-Kat experiment I posit that humans and kats are native to the Milky Way, and that in the past they were enslaved by the Goa'uld. (Ra and Bastet specifically)

On the other hand, how about this idea: What if in their universe the kats are native to Earth -OUR EARTH- and the humans actually originate from another planet?
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Cody Furlong » Sat Jan 23, 2021 6:09 pm

I once read a fan fiction to this extent, where after a nuclear holocaust, humans went extinct, and allowed for the Kats to evolve into the next dominant life form.
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Rusakov » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:56 pm

EditorElohim wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:38 pm
I have a few theories:

1) It's Earth, identical to ours - countries, governments, culture, geography, etc- ; only inhabited by kats instead of humans and.... I don't know, raccoons and otters instead of dogs and cats.
I find this one kind of hard to believe. Everything is identical (language, culture, etc) except the fact that kats evolved instead of people? That's such a massive change in history that I doubt everything else would be identical to our world.

Then again, there is The Mantra , so you could be right by fiat. :P
Last edited by Rusakov on Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Mikazo » Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:34 pm

Clearly the show takes place in a purr-allel universe. :)
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Rusakov » Tue Feb 02, 2021 10:07 am

Mikazo wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:34 pm
Clearly the show takes place in a purr-allel universe. :)
Your pun is bad and you should feel bad. RazSilly
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by EditorElohim » Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:01 am

Rusakov wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:56 pm
I find this one kind of hard to believe. Everything is identical (language, culture, etc) except the fact that kats evolved instead of people? That's such a massive change in history that I doubt everything else would be identical to our world.
Excuse me, did you just say that kats are not people? callieeyerollicon Oh, boy... TboneLaughCait

Anyway, back to the quote, there is a cartoon from about the same time called Rocko's Modern Life, which basically replicates that same concept (language, culture, etc) and does so in a more illogical world where there are all sorts of intelligent animal species; not just one.

At least in that one the kat world is more coherent .... No, Chopshop, you don't count: we don't even know what you are or if you are relevant. RazDark RazDark RazDark RazLaugh RazLaugh RazLaugh
Rusakov wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 10:07 am
Your pun is bad and you should feel bad.
He should rather be arrested XD FeralBullhornIcon FeralBullhornIcon
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by Kooshmeister » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm

The mere fact it crossed their minds to have the crew of the stolen water freighter be humans means that they did not intend for the planet to be Earth; all that was lost with the changed ending was onscreen confirmation of this fact. So even though they didn't use it, I consider the original idea for the ending of When Strikes Mutilor to be evidence of creator intent. The kat planet isn't Earth.

Even without knowing how When Strikes Mutilor was going to end, there's evidence here and there suggesting it's not Earth. The sky being the main one. The sky is green most of the time as opposed to blue (Chaos in Crystal notwithstanding; I maintain that it's blue in that episode to make the green Shard stand out). It also has its own prehistory, complete with unique dinosaur species that don't exist on Earth; nothing like the Megasaurus rex or the so-called "long-necked flying reptiles" ever existed here. Certainly, we have had animals somewhat like them, but not exactly like them.

Even (what are called) Pterodactyls and Plesiosaurs aren't quite like their Earth counterparts; the former are more of a mashup of different pterosaur traits, and the latter (as shown on the model sheets) have legs with very Apatosaurus-like feet in lieu of flippers. Even the sabertoothed tiger is not quite right, as it has a long tail when most big-fanged prehistoric felines had short tails.

Of course, none of this is necessarily evidence that the kat world isn't Earth; plenty of cartoons explicitly set on our own world get details about prehistoric animals all the time. Nevertheless, these facts when combined with the fact the planet has predominantly green skies suggest it is probably not Earth, not unless it's an Earth of a far, far distant future, meaning human history would predate even feline prehistory. My problem with this concept amounts to two things.

Firstly, if there was a civilization prior to the kat world's prehistoric era, you'd think there'd be some archaeological or fossil evidence of it, but none is presented. History as presented in the show basically seems to stop at the dinosaur era.

Secondly, it'd be an astounding coincidence for there to be a second dinosaur era after human civilization fail, as though the powers that be (God, nature, evolution, what-have-you) just hit the reset button and started over. It's equally fantastical that an alien world would progress along lines similar to ours (though the movie Planet of Dinosaurs put forth the idea that similar elements would bring about similar lifeforms), but I find that infinitely more believable than the idea that everything would just start over with dinosaurs again. That's what's keeping me from agreeing that it's Earth and there were human precursors to the kat civilization; I just don't see there spontaneously being a second prehistoric era that leaves no evidence of the past advanced civilization behind for kat archaeologists to find.
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Re: Hypothesis: humanity as extinct precursors

Post by EditorElohim » Tue Feb 02, 2021 10:34 pm

Before I start, does anyone know if it is possible to upload photos from my hard drive to the forum? Thank you very much.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
So even though they didn't use it, I consider the original idea for the ending of When Strikes Mutilor to be evidence of creator intent. The kat planet isn't Earth.
If we go down that road, that means Feral is an unscrupulous cretin willing to ally himself with a criminal capable of threatening the city HE swore to defend just to have a chance to defeat the Swat kats. But we know he's not like that from the HQ Enforcer incident, right?

The commander is not one of my favorite characters, but I admit he is what they say, a Jerk with a Heart of Gold.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
Even without knowing how When Strikes Mutilor was going to end, there's evidence here and there suggesting it's not Earth. The sky being the main one. The sky is green most of the time as opposed to blue (Chaos in Crystal notwithstanding; I maintain that it's blue in that episode to make the green Shard stand out).
That evidence is extremely poor to the point that it is not even circumstantial: It is the same as saying that the series does not take place on Earth because the sun and the moon look too big in the sky, when we all know that this is done as an artistic resource to give more drama or better aesthetics to the scene. As you yourself said, the sky in Chaos in Crystal is blue so that it is not confused with the color of Rex Shard, and in When Strikes Mutilor, if I remember correctly, the sky is yellow. -I guess to highlight the dryness of the water extraction process- I mean, the color of the sky in the program depends on the circumstances posed by the plot.

Or, it may be mere artistic license: in Invader Zim, the sky was reddish-yellowish during the day and purple-violet at night, while in Rocket Power, the daytime sky was yellowish, except for cloudy days when it was blue or gray. And if I remember correctly, both series take place mostly on Earth.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
It also has its own prehistory, complete with unique dinosaur species that don't exist on Earth; nothing like the Megasaurus rex or the so-called "long-necked flying reptiles" ever existed here. Certainly, we have had animals somewhat like them, but not exactly like them.

Even (what are called) Pterodactyls and Plesiosaurs aren't quite like their Earth counterparts; the former are more of a mashup of different pterosaur traits, and the latter (as shown on the model sheets) have legs with very Apatosaurus-like feet in lieu of flippers. Even the sabertoothed tiger is not quite right, as it has a long tail when most big-fanged prehistoric felines had short tails.
First, it may be due to Artistic License to create their own species; second, to know the totality of life forms from 65 to 70 million years ago is impossible... so one can say that they are still unknown species -at least to the audience- and third... well... not that they are so scientifically accurate: what we know about dinosaurs now has left the knowledge of the '90s quite obsolete.

Curious that you didn't mention the oil-eating worm. It was never made clear where it came from, but apart from that example -and the Creeplings-, most of the flora and fauna seen in the series, looks quite... terrestrial.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
not unless it's an Earth of a far, far distant future, meaning human history would predate even feline prehistory.
Or, it is an alternate Earth, just like ours, or Strangereal-style, where felines, not primates, evolved to become the dominant species. Or they were created by the Annunaki, I don't know.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
Firstly, if there was a civilization prior to the kat world's prehistoric era, you'd think there'd be some archaeological or fossil evidence of it, but none is presented. History as presented in the show basically seems to stop at the dinosaur era.
Have you heard of the Silurian theory, or Ooparts? -Out of place artifact- Well, most of the objects classified in this way are considered fakes, or else, justified with explanations sometimes not very credible by scientists.

Personally, I find it absurd to think that in the nearly 600 million years that the Earth has been harboring complex life, no alien species has colonized it for some time, or else, that only humans have evolved as an intelligent species and that before us there was nothing.

The truth is that it would be very difficult or almost impossible to find evidence of an advanced prehistoric civilization, given the passage of time that would wear away most of the materials until they disappear. Except for a great luck, the only place where it would be possible to find evidence of an ancient, prehistoric and advanced civilization would be the Moon and other planets where erosion or biological agents are almost non-existent.
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
Secondly, it'd be an astounding coincidence for there to be a second dinosaur era after human civilization fail, as though the powers that be (God, nature, evolution, what-have-you) just hit the reset button and started over.
Ehm... Sequel to the resounding failure of Jurassic World that ended up making humanity extinct? TboneLaughCait TboneLaughCait
Kooshmeister wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:08 pm
That's what's keeping me from agreeing that it's Earth and there were human precursors to the kat civilization; I just don't see there spontaneously being a second prehistoric era that leaves no evidence of the past advanced civilization behind for kat archaeologists to find.
Because it is possible that there never were human precursors, and the kats evolved on their own.

But if there were... Would there be evidence? Would humans have left them?

Suppose there were human precursors, something like the "Ancients" from Stargate , and they even ended up ascending to higher planes of existence and... whatever... The Kats would over time forget about their "precursors", turn them into gods of their own mythologies, or even become mere "ancient spirits" or "antiquated legends". As for the technology or remains they may have left behind, the passage of time could make them disappear, or corrode them beyond recognition as something artificially made, or if discovered, classified as "cult objects", a professional euphemism for "I haven't the faintest idea what this thing is".

Unless they are made of an incredibly durable unknown material.

And then there is the issue of academics, of whether they would be willing to acknowledge evidence that would crumble decades of their studies.

But back to the point after so much deflecting: no; I don't think the kat world is a post-apocalyptic world following an extinct humanity. Despite showing very little outside the city, the kat world looks pretty good, with no signs of any recent cataclysm, as the worlds of Fallout, Adventure Time or Shintzo would be.

In the end, and given that technically the series left it very ambiguous as to whether or not it takes place on Earth, it's up to everyone. And that's what fanfics are for. RazorHappyCait RazorHappyCait
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